Review Lengths

Angus is right. You're all mad if you think several thousand word reviews are actually being READ by anyone, member and consumer alike.

A double page feature spread in tabloid newspaper has around 1,500 words. You people are writing reviews that would span three, four, five, even six full pages of a tabloid newspaper and telling yourselves that they're useful. They're not. Nobody's reading them. Nobody.

krazykat2005 wrote:

Well I like the little extra bits in reviews that make me laugh, or are interesting to read even if not totally relevant... that's what makes them different to read.

But you are not the person the review is meant to be aimed at, so that is my point really. we/you/they are not writing for the consumer but to impress our fellow raters.

I have just booked a holiday independently too. (a few weeks ago)

tripadvisor is FAR superior than anything Dooyoo and Ciao can offer. OK, it is a dedicated site, but at least that way, I can quickly look and see ok 76 reviews for that hotel, average rating 3.5 stars, average price $150 and read a few comments...not 76 2000 word epics. I can then think, ok on budget, reasonable feedback, take a deeper look at what rates are available etc.

If I open a review on something and it would take me longer to read the review, than get in the car, go down town, purchase said item, come back, and eat it, or use it, then I often click out and don't read it to the end.

Or if I do, it's H material at best.

THis problem has been created by Ciao members, in terms that we think reviews should be entertaining for the benefit of other members, which is ridiculous.

Jill Murphy wrote:

Angus is right. You're all mad if you think several thousand word reviews are actually being READ by anyone, member and consumer alike.

A double page feature spread in tabloid newspaper has around 1,500 words. You people are writing reviews that would span three, four, five, even six full pages of a tabloid newspaper and telling yourselves that they're useful. They're not. Nobody's reading them. Nobody.

And Jill hates saying I am right.

Angus wrote:

Jill Murphy wrote:

Angus is right. You're all mad if you think several thousand word reviews are actually being READ by anyone, member and consumer alike.

A double page feature spread in tabloid newspaper has around 1,500 words. You people are writing reviews that would span three, four, five, even six full pages of a tabloid newspaper and telling yourselves that they're useful. They're not. Nobody's reading them. Nobody.

And Jill hates saying I am right.

Newspapers have smaller writing. The default ofnt size on Microsoft Word fo me is pretty big.

Now look at Playstation Magazines which i read-8 pages reviews with tiny writing and pictures withway more writing than me. Sure they can afford to be longer because people who buy the magazine are games fans but that explains games how you need too.

Quote :

But you are not the person the review is meant to be aimed at, so that is my point really. we/you/they are not writing for the consumer but to impress our fellow raters.

I might write reviews, but that does not mean I am not still a consumer as well. I frequently use Ciao and Dooyoo now before I buy something, and I rate on whether I think a review would be useful to me in making a purchase and on it's readability. Whether a review is useful has nothing to do with the length... it has to do with how easy it is to read and how good the personal opinion is, IMO.

butters wrote:

Well, on Microsoft Word (the font size is basically normal), where i write my reviews i tend to do a lot. Sometimes though, when saying about one thing, it doesnt tend to be paragraphs but they tend to be between 5-6 pages long.
What is the optimum length for a typical review, or in my case a game review.
I wouldnt mind knowing to improve. In a games review as well, should you describe all weapons etc.

Six pages would seem to be very long, and might be appropriate for some reviews, but not many.

I am no weapon yielding gamer, but I DON'T think describing everything in finite detail is what the reader needs to know.

Perhaps describing your experience e.g. I found the "insert name of weapon" easier to manouvre than the "insert name of another weapon" however the second weapon kills more trolls and if you can master this and earn more points, it unearths a hidden level.

Reviews which fall into the category of describing every single option (websites, games, anything like that) tend to be the ones where I would backspace, don't read any further

helencbradshaw wrote:

butters wrote:

Well, on Microsoft Word (the font size is basically normal), where i write my reviews i tend to do a lot. Sometimes though, when saying about one thing, it doesnt tend to be paragraphs but they tend to be between 5-6 pages long.
What is the optimum length for a typical review, or in my case a game review.
I wouldnt mind knowing to improve. In a games review as well, should you describe all weapons etc.

Six pages would seem to be very long, and might be appropriate for some reviews, but not many.

I am no weapon yielding gamer, but I DON'T think describing everything in finite detail is what the reader needs to know.

Perhaps describing your experience e.g. I found the "insert name of weapon" easier to manouvre than the "insert name of another weapon" however the second weapon kills more trolls and if you can master this and earn more points, it unearths a hidden level.

Reviews which fall into the category of describing every single option (websites, games, anything like that) tend to be the ones where I would backspace, don't read any further

I've got snother review about aagame with weapons on the way and i seriously plan to review them like this now. Thankyou:)

butters wrote:

I've got snother review about aagame with weapons on the way and i seriously plan to review them like this now. Thankyou:)

Glad I could help. I will look out for it. (Dooyoo or Ciao? ) Apply that logic to the characters too, instead of writing a curriculum vitae for each of them, and you will be on the way.

Jill Murphy wrote:

Angus is right. You're all mad if you think several thousand word reviews are actually being READ by anyone, member and consumer alike.

A double page feature spread in tabloid newspaper has around 1,500 words. You people are writing reviews that would span three, four, five, even six full pages of a tabloid newspaper and telling yourselves that they're useful. They're not. Nobody's reading them. Nobody.

I don't think anyone other than site members read food reviews and cheap toiletry reviews at all. Especially not 1500 word dissertations on the Packaging of the 252g Mars Bar, length 92.7mm (Not Giant Size from the Petrol Station, which are on 3 for 2 at Tescos and some Asdas) Variety.

If anyone tells me they think about having a chocolate bar and ACTUALLY first log on to Dooyoo, and research the cost before nipping down the offy, I simply dont believe you!

A pointless bit of reviewing - therefore!

Quote :

Newspapers have smaller writing. The default ofnt size on Microsoft Word fo me is pretty big.

Now look at Playstation Magazines which i read-8 pages reviews with tiny writing and pictures withway more writing than me. Sure they can afford to be longer because people who buy the magazine are games fans but that explains games how you need too.

Smaller writing?! HAAAAAAAAAAA! Jebus.

I've just looked at my son's copies of PS2 magazine and PCZone. They each have two or three headline reviews and four or five standard reviews per issue. The headline/feature reviews span three or four pages and comprise between 1200 and 1500 words - font size irrelevant. The standard reviews are all less than 500 words. And no, I didn't count them - I proof read and copy edit for a living and can estimate the number of words very quickly according to typesetting and column setting.

Professional writers struggle to hold a reader's interest past 2,000 words in any article. That's why features in any written medium punt themselves at less than that. The average reader doesn't keep attention past even fewer words than that, which is why tabloid articles are generally less than 1,200 and broadsheet articles go up to 1,800.

You're not being useful by writing epics. Nobody is actually bothering to read what you write, whatever they tell you.

Jill Murphy wrote:

Quote :

Newspapers have smaller writing. The default ofnt size on Microsoft Word fo me is pretty big.

Now look at Playstation Magazines which i read-8 pages reviews with tiny writing and pictures withway more writing than me. Sure they can afford to be longer because people who buy the magazine are games fans but that explains games how you need too.

Smaller writing?! HAAAAAAAAAAA! Jebus.

I've just looked at my son's copies of PS2 magazine and PCZone. They each have two or three headline reviews and four or five standard reviews per issue. The headline/feature reviews span three or four pages and comprise between 1200 and 1500 words - font size irrelevant. The standard reviews are all less than 500 words. And no, I didn't count them - I proof read and copy edit for a living and can estimate the number of words very quickly according to typesetting and column setting.

Professional writers struggle to hold a reader's interest past 2,000 words in any article. That's why features in any written medium punt themselves at less than that. The average reader doesn't keep attention past even fewer words than that, which is why tabloid articles are generally less than 1,200 and broadsheet articles go up to 1,800.

You're not being useful by writing epics. Nobody is actually bothering to read what you write, whatever they tell you.

Not being useful to some. Others i am useful too though as you can see in my ratings. I have said i will try to be more concise too. There are 10 page reviews in some maazines too by the way

Quote :

Nobody is actually bothering to read what you write, whatever they tell you.

Perhaps I am getting it wrong then, because I read long reviews properly if they are good.

Butters, I'm not having a pop at you. Honestly. But ratings on opinion sites are inflated to a ridiculous degree. Most of your raters haven't read what you've written. Unpleasant fact, but a true one. It's not your reviews, it's all reviews and particularly the long ones.

You must of course write whatever you want to write. Don't let me stop you. It's a free country and if you like writing long reviews, then write them. Do whatever you most enjoy doing.

BUT - don't convince yourself that anything that a tiny minority of opinion site members are reading anything other than your first and last paragraphs so they don't look silly when they comment, and don't convince yourself that thousands of words are actually useful, because they are not.

Jill Murphy wrote:

Butters, I'm not having a pop at you. Honestly. But ratings on opinion sites are inflated to a ridiculous degree. Most of your raters haven't read what you've written. Unpleasant fact, but a true one. It's not your reviews, it's all reviews and particularly the long ones.

You must of course write whatever you want to write. Don't let me stop you. It's a free country and if you like writing long reviews, then write them. Do whatever you most enjoy doing.

BUT - don't convince yourself that anything that a tiny minority of opinion site members are reading anything other than your first and last paragraphs so they don't look silly when they comment, and don't convince yourself that thousands of words are actually useful, because they are not.

Some parts are useful and its better to write too much than too little, at least the info is there.I agree not everyone reads too and know your not having a pop at me. I want to make my revies shorter and have the info to do so now

I refuse to believe anyone whos ays they read all the reviews the rate other than my reviews which are brilliant.

Angus wrote:

I refuse to believe anyone whos ays they read all the reviews the rate other than my reviews which are brilliant.

I dont know-do you not read all reviews then. It must be harsh considering they all read your because they are so goooood *drooling over brilliant review*

Another thought for Butters...

I know all about "game walkthroughs" as my son uses them regularly. From some of the things you've been saying on this thread, some of what you're writing sounds like a walkthough angle to me - describing weapons functions, etc. The thing is, most of the elements in a walkthrough (which I concede often need to be long) are intended for owners of games, not prospective purchasers. Walkthroughs are very different from reviews as they are for people who have already bought, not people who are thinking of buying. On Dooyoo/Ciao, you're writing for people who are thinking of buying - for themselves or for someone else.

If you are trying to include everything you should include, but at the same time make your reviews as easy-to-read and accessible as possible, think about a) what prospective purchasers need to know BEFORE they buy a game and b) who those prospective purchasers might be.

Prospective purchasers don't need blow by blow accounts of the plot and what to and when in the plot and descriptions of the entire arsenal together with functions of all the weapons. They need to know if the plot is exciting/interesting/gripping and if the weapons are great fun or just the same old stock stuff on every game.

Many prospective purchasers aren't even gamers. In fact, a very large proportion of them aren't. Many are parents and grandparent and aunts and uncles. I personally probably choose at least a dozen computer/console games a year for my kids. I know the kinds of things they like. I know one son likes strategy games with elaborate plots and lots of magic - good spells, not boring spells. I know the other one likes high-adrenalin sports games that are fairly easy to get to grips or hugely-detailed sports games with lots of stats. What I don't need to know is an exhaustive run down of the plot or a detailed description of every single weapon/player/cheat/blah.

Thanks-thats why i asked aboutweapons too. Next time i'll maybe say my best and worst weapon and how easy/fun they are to use.

butters wrote:

Angus wrote:

I refuse to believe anyone whos ays they read all the reviews the rate other than my reviews which are brilliant.

I dont know-do you not read all reviews then. It must be harsh considering they all read your because they are so goooood *drooling over brilliant review*

Do I not read all the reviews I rate?

No, very few of them if I am being honest.

I am a skimmer and I read car manuals, financial papers and referrence books exactly the same way. short reviews I read all the way through but like your gaming reviews, I skim through them and think "what the hell possesed someone to write so much about so little?"

If you want honesty from me, keep throwing the ball and I will fetch the answers for you but what I will say is this, when I gave you a positive rate, you put me in you COF, so if you appreciate my "friendship" then listen to what I have to say as it is my opinion. You do not have to change the way you think, act or write but it will always be the truth mate.

I am not after upsetting you but then I am not trying to impress you either.

Another thing, I try to write Useful reviews, not very useful or somehwat useful and I do not believ you can write a Very Useful review as 50% of the people who read it will never need or use the item so it should be law of averages have only 50% VU rates. that will never happen though as 90% of people whor ate reviews do it to get a read back.

I really dont give a shit who reads what I write or how they rate it as I stopped trying to impress people on review sites a long time ago and to be honest, I enjoyed reviewing so much more since I made that decision.

thanks for the honesty and i added you to my COFbecause you write good reviews and are honest in your opinion and i might actually write a a sequel to my rview tonight to have a bash at it.
I count skimming though as reading still. Thanks for the info but i think i have enough now

Poor Butters! Swamped by Jill and Angus who are both saying "don't you swamp"! There's an irony in that.

Jill Murphy wrote:

Angus is right. You're all mad if you think several thousand word reviews are actually being READ by anyone, member and consumer alike.

A double page feature spread in tabloid newspaper has around 1,500 words. You people are writing reviews that would span three, four, five, even six full pages of a tabloid newspaper and telling yourselves that they're useful. They're not. Nobody's reading them. Nobody.

Angus is never right!

I think in general Jill is right BUT it can depend on the review and how it is written.

For instance in a travel review that do tend to be longer than most, a several thousand word review can be useful. It can for instance include different sections on the accomodation, things to do and see for the area, eating and drinking etc. Now not all the sections will be useful to all the people but if they are clearly separated then a reader can pick and choose what they think will be useful to them. thus a long review can still be useful for those who don't want all the details and for those who want an extensive review of the destination etc then the whole of the review will be useful.

This could be true as well for game reviews, the important thing is if you are going to write a detailed review (and even then there are limits) is to clearly partition the sections so people can choose which bit is of interest to them.

In general though most reviews for books and film for instance I would say 1000-1500 words can be more than adequate for the purpose of the site. Most food and drink reviews could be even shorter....

Butters - am I correct in thinking you are at school?

If so, that would explain a lot - many teachers (in my experience both as a student and a parent) look for length - I remember as a kid padding and filling and writing or typing bigger and so forth to reach the necessary word length (largely because I hadn't done the research, and so had little to say). In high school, there was no upper word length (until 11th grade), but always a lower (usually the number of pages, but this was before the ubiquity of PCs).

Butters, if you really like a game, tell me why I'll like it, not every detail on how to play it - you're not writing the instruction manual.

That's what I think, anyway - and I'm VERY verbose, so I do sympathise.

mattygroves wrote:

Butters - am I correct in thinking you are at school?

If so, that would explain a lot - many teachers (in my experience both as a student and a parent) look for length - I remember as a kid padding and filling and writing or typing bigger and so forth to reach the necessary word length (largely because I hadn't done the research, and so had little to say). In high school, there was no upper word length (until 11th grade), but always a lower (usually the number of pages, but this was before the ubiquity of PCs).

Butters, if you really like a game, tell me why I'll like it, not every detail on how to play it - you're not writing the instruction manual.

That's what I think, anyway - and I'm VERY verbose, so I do sympathise.

Yep at school and doing GCSE's. My english teacher always comments how i write freakishly long and fast but i getgood grades due to detail. I just need to know the difference between a review and a walkthrough really! I suggested a game so i'll see if i can improve